Unusual or unanticipated uses of asbestos on or in buildings:

This article provides examples of examples of unusual uses of asbestos insulation material in buildings, most likely also hazards that should be evaluated.

This document assists building buyers, owners or inspectors who need to identify asbestos materials (or probable-asbestos) in buildings by simple visual inspection. We provide photographs and descriptive text of asbestos insulation and other asbestos-containing products to permit identification of definite, probable, or possible asbestos materials in buildings.

Page top photo: an asbestos-containing gas fireplace log in a home in San Miguel de Allende, Guanajuato.

Examples of unusual uses of asbestos insulation material in buildings

Article Index

• ASBESTOS in UNUSUAL PLACES
• ASBESTOS FLOOR INSULATION
• ASBESTOS in GAS FIREPLACE BACKER
• GAS FIREPLACE LOG ASBESTOS
• ASBESTOS in LAMPS & LIGHT BULBS
• RADIANT HEAT PANEL ASBESTOS

Asbestos pipe insulation, found under attic floor as house insulation

In our photograph we show some unusual "attic insulation," made of corrugated asbestos "paper" laid flat, was in the floor of a 1940s house in New York state.

[Click to enlarge any image]

We speculated that the installer had a source of "free" insulation and that it was installed before the asbestos scare.

Asbestos Gas-Fireplace Materials in Old Houses

This pre-1900 gas fireplace found in a Minnesota home used tufts of asbestos fibers to support the heating flame. [Photograph courtesy Roger Hankey.]

Asbestos use in Gas Fireplace Logs

Question: when did gas fireplaces use asbestos logs, rocks, ashes?

2017/09/19 Bill said:

Is it likely that a 1991-93 gas fireplace has asbestos logs, rocks, or ashes?

This question was posted originally at ASBESTOS PHOTO GUIDE to MATERIALS

Reply: U.S. Title 16 › Chapter II › Subchapter B Consumer Product Safety Act › Part 1305 › Section 1305.5: asbestos in emberizing materials

This title contains U.S. Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) rules and proposed rules published in the U.S. Federal Register relating to Title 16

Bill,

The answer depends largely on when and where the gas-logs were manufactured and sold. For example in the U.S. it would be highly unlikely to find asbestos gas-logs in 1991, but in some other countries such products may still have been marketed.

The U.S. CFR regulation I excerpt below had its first version published in the Congressional Record on 7 July 1983 - see the search I used given in citations below.

In the CURRENT U.S. Title 16 › Chapter II › Subchapter B› Part 1305 › Section 1305.5 (Thanks to Cornell Law School, Legal Information Institute)

§ 1305.5 Findings.

(a) The degree and nature of the risk of injury. The Commission finds that the risk of injury which this regulation is designed to eliminate or reduce is from cancer, including lung cancer and mesothelioma.

Measurements are not available of the amounts of asbestos in the air from asbestos-containing emberizing materials in homes.

However, it appears that the amount of airborne asbestos in such homes would increase when air currents in the home are created by downdrafts from a fireplace chimney or other activities that stir air in any room.

Since emberizing materials may contain up to 50 percent asbestos, which if not permanently bound into artificial fireplace logs would be in respirable form, the risk associated with emberizing materials is considerable, especially since it continues to exist 24 hours a day.

(b) Products subject to the ban. Artificial emberizing materials are decorative simulated ashes or embers, used in certain gas-buring fireplace systems, which glow to give the appearance of real burning embers.

The material is sprinkled on or glued to gas logs, or sprinkled on fireplace floors.

(c) Need of the public for the products and effects of the rule on their utility, cost, and availability. Artificial fireplace emberizing material serves a strictly decorative purpose and does not materially affect the actual performance of the fireplace gas system in terms of its ability to provide heat.

A certain degree of aesthetic desirability exists, however, since the product “system” itself (the gas log, ashes, and embers) is intended to simulate burning wooden logs.

Gas logs may be sold with artificial emberizing material attached at the factory (the log commonly referred to as being “frosted”), or with the “embers” in a separate kit, often mixed with simulated “ashes.”

Virtually all gas logs are either frosted or packaged with an emberizing kit; however, the majority of gas logs produced in 1977 were packaged with non-asbestos-containing emberizing kits.

The Commission estimates annual sales of artificial gas logs at approximately 100,000 units. Some 25,000-30,000 of these would be subject to the ban.

Approximately 100,000 gas logs frosted or treated by consumers with asbestos are estimated to be in existence.

The Commission believes that the majority of gas logs are sold with emberizing kits; this gives the consumer a choice as to whether or not to use the artificial embers and ashes.

(1) Utility. Manufacturers of artificial gas log emberizing material are currently using four substitutes for asbestos in their products: vermiculite, rock wool, mica, and a synthetic fiber.

None of the four is claimed to be as aesthetically effective as asbestos. Thus, the utility derived by consumers from some gas-burning fireplace systems may be adversely affected.

• GAS FIREPLACE / LOG MANUALS provides resources including patent history of gas logs and gas fireplaces and the use of asbestos in those products in the U.S. beginning before 1900
• Original source for the 1983 regulation, see: https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-1983-07-07/pdf/FR-1983-07-07.pdf [be warned this is a huge document, the entie Federal Registger for 7 July 1983 - Ed.]
  
  Current: Title 16 - Commercial Practices, Chapter II - CONSUMER PRODUCT SAFETY COMMISSION Subchapter B - CONSUMER PRODUCT SAFETY ACT REGULATIONS Part PART 1305—BAN OF ARTIFICIAL EMBERIZING MATERIALS (ASH AND EMBERS) CONTAINING RESPIRABLE FREE-FORM ASBESTOS [PDF] retrieved 2017/11/09, original source: https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2012-title16-vol2/pdf/CFR-2012-title16-vol2-part1305.pdf Date January 1, 2017
• U.S. Title 16 › Chapter II › Subchapter B › Part 1305 › Section 1305.5 [PDF, Cornell Law School, Legal Information Institute, retrieved 2017/09/19, original source: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/16/1305.5
• How to Search the U.S. CFR Federal Register: To search the US CFR use this website: https://www.govinfo.gov/app/search/

 

Asbestos Use in Glass-Faced Radiant Heat Panels?

Question: was asbestos used in old glass radiant electric heat panels?

2017/12/02 Marie said:

Hi, I have some old glass radiant electric heat panels (maybe from the 1960's?) that were the heating system in my house

Rad. I replaced them several years ago with a non-glass radiant panel. I'm now trying to re-purpose or recycle the glass panels, but I notice that they are backed with a putty-like substance behind the metal grid and I'm wondering if that substance contains asbestos.

Reply:

Sorry,
I can't say for all radiant heater brands but at least some radiant heat glass panel products used asbestos in various components as I'll detail in our research findings below..

Can you tell me brand and model and attach a photo?

Reader follow-up:

Marie said

I can't find any markings of a brand name. I know Glassheat was one of the popular brands at that time. Panels are about 25" x 17".

Reply:

As some radiant heaters that used glass panels used asbestos in glazing putties as well as in some gaskets it would be prudent to assume that is the case for your heater. Asbestos was also uses as components of the heating element inside of some glass fronted and other radiant heaters.

I'm doubtful that asbestos forms a component of the glass panel itself.

Patent research confirms that asbestos was used in radiant heaters made by Glassheat in the 1950s, in at least one instance:

• "Radiant heater and tray." U.S. Patent 2,613,308, issued October 7, 1952.

And asbestos was used or at least discussed in several forms such as asbestos gaskets in a variety of radiant heaters:

• Le B, M.B., Albert C Nolte, 1959. Electric heating devices and the like. U.S. Patent 2,889,439.

including sometimes as a component of the heating element as recently as 1981:

• Semanaz, Daniel, and Robert Cassat. "Heating element." U.S. Patent 4,272,673, issued June 9, 1981.
  
  Excerpt: The heating element as defined by claim 6, wherein the reinforcing filler is selected from the group consisting of mica flakes, asbestos fibers, glass fibers, ceramic fibers, nonwovens comprised of glass fibers, batts of glass fibers and nonwovens comprised of asbestos fibers.

Reader follow-up

Marie said: Thank you. I will dispose of them with that in mind.

Asbestos used in light bulbs?

This topic has moved to its own page

at ASBESTOS in LAMPS & LIGHT BULBS

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Reader Q&A - also see RECOMMENDED ARTICLES & FAQs

On 2021-11-11 15:28:12.991732 by Inspectapedia Com Moderator (mod)

@Peter,

Thank you for a helpful question on asbestos in a lamp base.

Please find your question and our detailed reply now at

ASBESTOS in LAMPS & LIGHT BULBS

inspectapedia.com/hazmat/Asbestos-in-Light-Bulbs.php

and don't hesitate to post follow-up questions, comments, suggestions, photos

On 2021-11-10 by Peter

Could this old fluorescent desk lamp contain asbestos? The base has this soft pad on the bottom and I was concerned it could be asbestos. The date of manufacture is unknown. More pictures here: https://imgur.com/a/kylJYJH

On 2021-10-04 by inspectapedia.com.moderator (mod) - old gas fire with mock coals have asbestos ?

@Phil North,
It is true that at one time, some gas fire decorative components, such as ash, embers, or logs, were known to contain asbestos.

If you could post a photo, it would helpful in more accurately answering your question. Is there any label or marking of the brand of fireplace?

Some of the information on this page may be helpful if you know more information about your fireplace:

GAS LOG FIREPLACE MANUALS
https://inspectapedia.com/heat/Gas-Fireplace-Heater-Manuals.php

On 2021-10-04 by Phil North

Will my fireplace which contains an old gas fire with mock coals have asbestos ? It was built in 1937 .

On 2020-12-24 - by (mod) -

I haven't found an authoritative I haven't found an authoritative answer to your question. I would not assume that because a part is available today asbestos free that the parts were always made without asbestos.

Asbestos was certainly used in the form of insulation and as asbestos-cement boards used as backers behind some radiators and other heating appliances.

On 2020-12-24 by ufemizm

Question: was asbestos ever used in the ceramic radiants in antique radiant heaters? Somehow I doubt it as radiants are still sold for those old (c.1900) radiant heaters.

On 2020-08-31 - by (mod) -

Nick,

One would not expect asbestos-containing products in a 2004-built home.

On 2020-08-26 by Nick

Is this asbestos in the Napoleon gas fireplace in my house? the house was built in 2004 in Canada

On 2020-02-19 - by (mod) -

Amy I've not seen fluffy asbestos fiber in a gas fireplace but imagine it's possible that a mineral fiber was included along the gas burner orifices so as to break up the flame for added realism. If the material in question is really asbestos (attach some sharp photos, 1 per comment so we can see what you see) then I'd figure that the fake logs may also contain asbestos. In that case it'd be reasonable disconnect, bag, and remove the entire assembly intact.

On 2020-02-19 by AMY

We just moved into an antique home with pre-1900 fluffy asbestos fiber in the gas fireplaces. What would be the best way to deal with this? Thanks so much

On 2020-02-19 - by (mod) - fluffy asbestos fiber in a gas fireplace

Amy I've not seen fluffy asbestos fiber in a gas fireplace but imagine it's possible that a mineral fiber was included along the gas burner orifices so as to break up the flame for added realism.

If the material in question is really asbestos (attach some sharp photos, 1 per comment so we can see what you see) then I'd figure that the fake logs may also contain asbestos.

In that case it'd be reasonable disconnect, bag, and remove the entire assembly intact.

On 2020-02-19 by AMY

We just moved into an antique home with pre-1900 fluffy asbestos fiber in the gas fireplaces. What would be the best way to deal with this? Thanks so much

On 2018-06-02 by Mike

Trying to figure out what this is. Its above the lathe in a 1920s craftsman ceiling. I believe an addition was put on some time in the 30s-50s to convert attic to living space. Im removing plaster on first floor and came across this. Whitish in color, almost a tan when soaked in water. Crumbles into a grainy powder, somewhat soft. Any ideas?

IMAGE LOST by older version of Clark Van Oyen’s useful Comments code - now fixed. Please re-post the image if you can. Sorry. Mod.

On 2017-12-05 - by (mod) -

Marie:

To have space for research citations and for the photo that you posted using the comments box I've moved our conversation to the end of the article above on this page. Thanks for the discussion. - Editor

On 2017-11-09 by Linda

Thanks for the info. RH Peterson is working on tracking down info for me. They have been great. I have a child with a genetic condition that causes him to have lots of health problems.

Based on the info you provided, I'm still not sure if it's riskier to leave the fireplace alone and not use it or to have it tested and, as the EPA said, potentially risk disturbing asbestos. Do you happen to know, if we do test, would keeping my child out of the house for a couple of days after testing help to mitigate the risk?

Also, if I just leave it alone, don't use the fireplace, and keep the damper closed, can the asbestos fibers still get in to my home? I'm happy to pay to have a trained professional test, I am just trying to figure out how to minimize the risk to my son.

On 2017-11-09 - by (mod) -

Linda

What did RH Peterson tell you about the use of asbestos in their products? A search of their site for "asbestos" returned null.

Typically asbestos was used in some gas fire logs and on occasion it might have been used in place of mineral wool or mixed with mineral wool to produce glowing embers around the log base. In my OPINION that would be a greater potential hazard than undisturbed gas logs. If your fireplace uses sand or glass or mineral wool, those aren't asbestos materials.

At GAS LOG FIREPLACE MANUALS - inspectapedia.com/heat/HVAC-Manuals-Air-Conditioners-Boiler-Furnaces-F-I.php#GasLog

you'll find this helpful PDF
Cornell Law School, ASBESTOS in GAS LOGS 16 CFR 1305.5 - Findings. Injuries from asbestos in gas logs [PDF]
at inspectapedia.com/hazmat/Asbestos-Gas-Logs-US-16-CFR-1305.5.pdf

That source and the CPSC cited glue melting at high temperatures on the logs, releasing emberizing material that contained asbestos.

that describes the hazard sources. Those emberizing materials on gas logs were banned in the U.S.

Also in some older gas-log fireplaces vermiculite was used at the fire base. Some vermiculite, depending on where it was mined, contained asbestos. See VERMICULITE INSULATION -https://inspectapedia.com/insulation/Vermiculite_Insulation.php

On 2017-11-09 - by (mod) -

Linda

What did RH Peterson tell you about the use of asbestos in their products? A search of their site for "asbestos" returned null.

Typically asbestos was used in some gas fire logs and on occasion it might have been used in place of mineral wool or mixed with mineral wool to produce glowing embers around the log base. In my OPINION that would be a greater potential hazard than undisturbed gas logs. If your fireplace uses sand or glass or mineral wool, those aren't asbestos materials.

At GAS LOG FIREPLACE MANUALS -

you'll find this helpful PDF

Cornell Law School, ASBESTOS in GAS LOGS 16 CFR 1305.5 - Findings. Injuries from asbestos in gas logs [PDF]

that describes the hazard sources.

On 2017-11-09 by Linda

Thank you so much for your response, danjoefriedman. I did have someone come out who said they would need to test three "components" of the logs. I told him I needed to do some research before proceeding

. I am fine with trusting the company, I'm just concerned that there are additional components (other than the glowing embers) that would need to be tested. Any idea what other two components in a gas fireplace produced in the 1980s would need to be tested? I did contact RH Peterson. They have been very responsive. Thanks again for your help.

On 2017-11-09 by (mod) - Real Fyre Glowing Embers G4 Series Burner Split Oak SG4-24 gas logs

Linda,

Nobody is likely to bet their retirement savings on making promises about hazards from materials described in a simple e-text and otherwise unknown, but certainly either you trust the literature as pertaining to your gas logs or you don't.

Or you could contact the manufacturer to ask for confirmation that your logs are asbestos free - you'll want the date of manufacture or at least the date of installation of the gas log.

RealFyre gas logs are produced by Robert H. Peterson Co. • 14724 East Proctor Avenue • City of Industry, CA 91746 USA Website: http://www.rhpeterson.com/, Tel: 800 332 3973

You can see a typical RealFyre gas log owners' manual here in PDF form
https://inspectapedia.com/chimneys/Real-Fyre-Gas-Log-Manual-RH-Peterson.pdf

If you are worrying, the health effects from that stress might be bad enough to justify the cost of a simple asbestos material test. Search InspectApedia for ASBESTOS TEST LAB LIST if you need that service. The lab will instruct you on safe sampling, typically you're simply wetting an area and pinching off an very tiny sample of material - a procedure that would not be expected to release a detectable indoor air particle hazard.

On 2017-11-09 by Linda - Real Fyre Glowing Embers G4 Series Burner Split Oak SG4-24 gas logs

We have Real Fyre Glowing Embers G4 Series Burner Split Oak SG4-24 gas logs in our home. They were installed some time between 1984 and 1991.

The literature that came with the gas logs and was passed on to us when we bought the house says, "Real-Fyre®Glowing Embers (Item #10) are specially​ ​formulated and sized to create the most authentic,uniform "glow," and...are​ ​nonflammable and inert, containing no asbestos."

Also, based on the literature provided, it looks like sand was used with our natural gas system as opposed to vermiculite which would be used with a propane gas system. Do I need to have this tested for asbestos? If so, what specific components need to be sampled and tested?

When I called the Regional EPA office, they indicated that testing may be more hazardous because it would disturb the area. Maybe testing would make things worse? Please advise. Signed, A Worried Mom

On 2017-09-20 - by (mod) -

No, bill, volcanic rock is completely different from and looks nothing like a log. Volcanic rock is a natural material, porous rock created by volcanic action. It looks like rocks not like a log.

You can see photos of typical gas fireplace logs at the top of the article on this page. You're also welcome to send me photos of your gas fireplace using the page top or bottom contact link

On 2017-09-20 by Bill

MORE INFO: The fireplace I asked about earlier was manufactured by Superior Fireplaces in California between 1991-93. It have volcanic rock and no ash. It satisfies all ANSI specifications. Is this likely to have asbestos logs.

...

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