Asbestos in Popcorn Ceiling Paint Spray FAQs:

Questions & answers about asbestos-containing ceiling paint: asbestos was used as a filler in popcorn ceiling paint - a nubbled or pebbled surface sprayed onto interior ceilings.

This article series describes how to recognize, test, and remove, cover, or renovate popcorn style ceiling paints that may contain asbestos. We include 5photographs and descriptive text of asbestos insulation and other asbestos-containing products to permit identification of definite, probable, or possible asbestos materials in buildings.

Q&A on Asbestos-containing "popcorn" or textured ceiling paint coatings

These questions and answers about asbestos-containing ceiling paints & popcorn ceilings were posted originally

at CEILING PAINT TEXTURED / POPCORN ASBESTOS - be sure to see the advice given there.

On 2023-10-07 by InspectApedia DF (mod)

@Anonymous,

I cannot imagine a reason that a college geology department would nor should be prohibited from displaying samples of various minerals, including forms of asbestos.

I would expect, of course, that the display of any potentially hazardous material anywhere would be arranged with appropriate containment and thus safety.

OPINION: The days of book burning should be way behind us. People are not served well, not in safety nor general well being, if we prohibit the study of subjects that might make some of us uncomfortable.

On 2023-09-14 by Anonymous

@InspectApedia Publisher, actually i saw a similar ceiling in stony brook University, but the bumps seems much smaller. i was told the building was renovated in 2012. the ceiling also looked new and modified not long ago.

in my college's geology buildong there was a mini museums, it was displaying asbestos mineral called anthophylite along with other minetals, although behind a thick glass. is this allowed?

On 2023-09-13 by InspectApedia Publisher

@Anonymous,

Of course the rules apply but whether they're enforced is a different matter.

It's also the case of the school management would probably not want the liability of leaving a questionable or potentially hazardous material in place.

It might be removed or encapsulated.

With respect, more discussion or guessing on this, since we have not one iota of actual information, is so speculative is to not be useful.

On 2023-09-13 by Anonymous

@Anonymous, does this rule apply to colleges?

On 2023-09-07 by InspectApedia DF (mod) - "what is popcorn ceiling?"

@Anonymous,

Popcorn ceilings are made from a spray-on material consisting of paint mixed with an acoustic material like Styrofoam beads or vermiculite.

On 2023-09-07 by Anonymous

@InspectApedia Publisher, when was this SOP taken? i not worrying about it now, i am just saying back to during 2009 if tge action was not tsken yet.

what is popcorn ceiling? is it like a sheet of paper that is adhered onto the ceiling?

On 2023-09-06 by InspectApedia Publisher (mod)

@Anonymous,

Please understand that we can't make any absolute assurance about a building at an unknown location and where we know nothing at all about the building is history or its management. But what we are telling you is what is SOP in New York state which is that you wouldn't expect asbestos to be left in schools.

On 2023-09-06 by Anonymous

@InspectApedia Publisher, were they all removed？ whether in good or bad condition?

i once recalled during 2009 i was in elemantry school, and may saw some similar textured ceiling. were popcorn ceiling in school taken care already that year?

On 2023-09-06 by InspectApedia Publisher - "for school buildings do they left popcorn ceiling in NY"

@Anonymous,

No, We would have not expect to find asbestos containing popcorn ceiling paint and schools in New York.

On 2023-09-06 by Anonymous

for school buildings do they left popcorn ceiling in NY?

On 2022-12-08 by InspectApedia (Editor)

@AJ,

There is no significant probability of a worrisome asbestos contamination from a brief bump into the ceiling that you described if you cleaned up the floor as you described: damp wipe and EPA vac.

About the rug, HEPA vac the exposed end or whole rug, or to be very thorough you might have it cleaned professionally.

After garage cleanup is complete you can certainly air it out with its door open for a few hours for added comfort.

On 2022-12-07 by AJ

Hello, I really appreciate all of the helpful information that you post on this website. I wanted to get your opinion about a possible exposure to asbestos from popcorn ceilings that were sprayed in the 80’s.

I was moving a new rug out of a garage that has popcorn ceilings, and accidentally bumped the ceiling with the end of the rug. I would say I saw about 15-20 flakes fall off the ceiling onto the garage floor and onto my new rug. Some may have also fallen onto some boxes, but it was hard to see.

I cleaned up what I saw on the floor and carpet with a wet rag, tied it in a couple bags and discarded it. My question is, should I avoid allowing my kids and family in the garage for sometime until the asbestos fibers settle?

We also do laundry in that garage, so is there risk of contaminating some of our clothes in that room? And should I throw away that rug? I’m sorry, I’m just trying to be as safe as possible. Thank you for reading this.

and just for context… this garage was once a room, and I was told that it was sprayed in 1988 at the very earliest. Is there still cause for concern? Thank you very much.

On 2021-08-12 by inspectapedia.com.moderator - names of spray-on encapsulation products for covering asbestos containing popcorn ceilings?

@Noah Christoff,

IF the ceiling is in good condition and already painted that may be enough; but if you want to use a paint that's intended for sealing see

ASBESTOS ENCAPSULANTS & SEALERS https://inspectapedia.com/hazmat/Asbestos-Sealers-Encapsulants.php

On 2021-08-11 by Noah Christoff

Hello, can someone tell me the names of spray on encapsulation products for covering asbestos containing popcorn ceilings? I'm setting up a music studio in my house and anticipate some LOUD vibrations and want to prevent any poocorn dust from shaking down.

On 2021-05-31 by Marcus

@inspectapedia.com.moderator,

Of course. Without data it's difficult to say anything definitive. I'll take your advice and see if I can find any dust to have analyzed for potential residual fibers. Regardless, it does bring me reassurance that you don't believe there to be a significant threat based on my description.

I'm aware that worry can be detrimental to health, so I'll try my best to put this to bed. Thanks for your help.

On 2021-05-31 by inspectapedia.com.moderator - must have actual factual objective data to estimate exposure to a possibly hazardous material

@Marcus,

No one can possibly estimate exposure to a possibly hazardous material beyond what we have already discussed.

- we don't even know if asbestos was present at all in the room
- we have no data on how much dust from the ceiling was airborne, in carpets, distributed by vacuuming
- we have no data on the amount of contact between your materials that might pick up dust and room surfaces, air, air movement, humidity, temperature, velocity, etc.

Those are just examples.

Without actual factual objective data, everything else is wild speculation with no basis.

However from your general description of the situation, even if the ceiling was a popcorn-painted surface, there is no reasonable basis for panic, anxiety, worry, about extensive asbestos contamination of your car, cellphone, clothing.

Please consider my earlier suggestion to address your worry: get some objective data.

Beyond that step, the only remaining useful step you should take is to discuss your concerns with your doctor.

On 2021-05-31 by Marcus

@danjoefriedman,

Thank you for your reply. I appreciate your helpful advice and opinion so far on this matter. The article you referenced is an excellent example of something to be cautious of in a scenario such as this.

After reading your assessment, your mention of a square foot has caused me to pause and wonder if the measurements I gave were an underestimate. To be on the safe side, I want to say that the total area of missing popcorn texture (including the other smaller missing patches I described in my initial question) was probably more than a square foot, but likely not exceeding two square feet.

Unfortunately, I did not take a picture of the damage, so I'd rather overestimate than underestimate. Does this change your assessment of the risk at all? At what point would the ceiling actually be dangerous in this scenario?

Relative to the total size of the ceiling, this probably isn't that much more space. However, unless I get this clarified, the doubt will weigh on me. I'm aware that I may seem paranoid, but I want to be absolutely sure that I have described the situation to the best of my ability.

On 2021-05-30 by danjoefriedman (mod)

@Marcus,

Thank you for asking a helpful question that gives an opportunity to explain the bounds of reasonable probability of exposure to hazardous levels of asbestos from staying in a building where that material might have been present.

There is no reasonable probability that the exposure circumstances that you described have created a detectable asbestos hazard on hard surfaces such as a cell phone or your car as you drove away, etc.

What makes sense is to obtain your own piece of mind by cleaning soft goods such as clothing, wiping hard items, and putting the question to bed.

Keep in mind that the anxiety about a very low probability hazard such as the one you describe can itself be a more serious risk to your health.

If it will help you get past the worry on this subject, collect a vacuum of tape sample of the most suspect dust from the most suspect item that you have, and have that examined by a forensic laboratory.

From your description of the circumstance, there's virtually no significant probability that you will detect any asbestos on your clothing, cellphone, nor car from an overnight stay in a room where a ceiling that might have had a popcorn ceiling spray coating that might have had asbestos and that was missing less than a square foot of material.

You might also want to search this website for our article entitled

OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY

to read my opinion and warning about how people will feel forced take your money to protect themselves from a dispute with you later, basically spending your money to reduce their risk.

It's a reason to be careful in matters like the question that you raised.

On 2021-05-30 by Marcus

Recently, I stayed one night in a hotel room with a popcorn ceiling. Unfortunately, I noticed that this particular ceiling had some damage - possibly from a water leak. There was a large patch (about 10 by 5 inches or so) of popcorn missing, as well as a crack and some smaller patches that also had missing popcorn.

Naturally, I am concerned about possible asbestos exposure. The building was constructed in the 70s, but was renovated a few times since then. The hotel engineering told me that the popcorn ceiling in my renovated room was not original, but have yet to send me the supporting documentation. Accordingly, I am skeptical.

Because the asbestos content of the ceiling is ambiguous, I’ve decided I should just assume that it's asbestos positive. Because this was a one-off stay in a hotel room, I am never returning to this location. Thus, my concern from this situation is primarily the potential for long term exposure from things I had with me at the time.

Here are some questions I have regarding that:

- What should I do with items I had in the room? I have been told that I can wash my clothes, but what about other things I had with me like my phone or laptop? I know I can wipe these items down, but what about areas like the ports or the gaps between the keys on the keyboard?

- What about the interior of my car that I got into after I was inside of the room? I wore unwashed clothes that were in the room when I entered the car, so fibers may have transferred to the seats, etc.

- How much asbestos do you think would have been airborne in the room? I certainly wasn’t there when the ceiling was damaged (I’m not sure how long it has been in this condition), and there were no visible debris. I’m aware that the fibers can become embedded into the carpets and other porous items in the room, so those contain a potential risk.

- What would you, an expert, do if you found yourself in my situation?

Obviously, it can be difficult to accurately ascertain exposure risk from a scenario described in a comment. However, in this case, I'm not sure what else I can do besides ask for consultation. Obviously, I did not sample the material at the time (I had no supplies to do it and didn't want to disturb a possible ACM), so I'm dependent on the hotel providing the documentation (which I may never receive). While I'm willing to dispose of all items if a genuine risk is present, I don't want to act unnecessarily.

On 2021-04-10 by (mod) - How do I find out if I need to do something about the possibility that there was a previous asbestos dust hazard in my home?

@Anonymous, or Mia, regarding your questions [given below] that I would re-phrase as:

How do I find out if I need to do something about the possibility that there was a previous asbestos dust hazard in my home?

Your questions and my replies are below. Thank you for asking. Let's hope this will help other readers.

----

QUESTION: I don't know who to ask. [about evaluating the hazard that I have been previously or am currently exposed to dangerous asbestos dust in my home]

REPLY: to get beyond arm-waving speculation and to base any health or economic decisions on fact, you'd need to hire an environmental professional, NOT to stop by to do a "test" (that approach of testing by itself is fundamentally flawed) but to take a case history, inspect the building, decide what if any environmental testing would be useful, and to do that along with a written report of findings and advice about what further cleaning or other steps are justified and appropriate.

It is not clear that such is needed, appropriate, useful, for the case you describe. To help decide see

MOLD / ENVIRONMENTAL EXPERT, HIRE ? - when to hire an expert

---

QUESTION: I just don't know what to do, because I am scared of any dust now and using furniture and even washing the clothes and all these days are very stressful and my bf thinks i am crazy. I just dont know what to do and looking if someone with asbestos knowledge would have an answer.

REPLY: Watch out: for some environmental hazards such as where the material is now long-gone, essentially-gone, and for which there is no actual exposure data the health hazards of extreme anxiety and stress may be greater than the remaining environmental contaminants.

REPLY: Discuss your fears with your doctor and ask her if health tests or home environmental tests would be appropriate and useful.

----

QUESTION: What if I assume there was 2 tablespoons of drywall or ceiling paint dust spread around?

So to make the situation simpler, if 2 tablespoons of drywall powder with asbestos and 2 tablespoon of popcorn ceiling powder with asbestos would be all over carpet, clothes and furniture, but remaining powder would be already wiped up on all visible places, the balcony would be open every day few hours already, but there might be asbestos in some furniture, carpet, hidden spaces, what would you please suggest?

REPLY: Because we have no data on which to base your assumption about the quantity of dust that was actually present, and no data to tell us of its asbestos content, if any, so it is not useful, nor diagnostic, nor prescriptive to spend your or other people's time and money on such guesswork.

-----

QUESTION: What kind of test for asbestos should I have? Would air test detect anything? The dust test even though everything was wiped would show anything?

REPLY: You could use a surface vacuum test or tape test (search InspectApedia.com for TAPE & BULK SAMPLING & TESTS for MOLD ) to see if an environmental test lab finds significant levels of harmful asbestos remaining in representative samples of house dust taken from horizontal surfaces in your home, choosing representative areas where you spend time, that have not been cleaned for a while and that might capture the "worst case" presence of harmful dust.

This is not a quantitative approach but if, for example, a lab reported a significant level of asbestos in such a dust sample, the additional professional cleaning could be appropriate.

Air testing for airborne particles has a use as a tool in the hands of an expert but such tests are fundamentally inaccurate even when the numbers given are very precise. A test that says it found 193 particles of X in air could be off by up to 4 orders of magnitude depending on how the test was conducted. So the "true" number might be less than 1 particle per liter or cubic meter of air, or it might be 19 or 193 or 19,300 or 193,000 or 1,930,000 particles per cubic meter of air.

Don't confuse precision ( a number with lots of digits or decimal places) with accuracy (is it actually close to reality?)

-----

QUESTION: Or if I just wet wipe all possible dust, and vacuum carpet, shoes and furniture, I can feel safe? Would you please know if washing in front load washing machine (without dryer) helps to remove asbestos?


Damp wiping and HEPA vacuuming are the typical cleanup methods; soft goods like clothes or curtains, **IF** there is data to justify a claim of asbestos contamination are either laundered, dry-cleaned, or thrown out, depending on relative costs.

Watch out: do not use an ordinary household vacuum cleaner if you suspect there is asbestos dust present as those small particles will go right through the vacuum cleaner and will be more airborne than ever- you'll increase any risk of breathing harmful dist.

-----

QUESTION: If there would be some hidden dust remaining in some spots or furniture, would that be dangerous and I could be exposed every day, or the exposure would be minimal and I dont have to worry.

REPLY: Nobody can assess the possible hazard of an unknown quantity of dust containing an unknown quantity of asbestos involving an unknown level of exposure over an unknown actual exposure time. Don't distress yourself nor throw money at the need for reassurance - discuss your worries with your doctor, or hire a professional.

Watch out: see OTHER PEOPLE's MONEY Why consultants spend your money to reduce their risk where your risk cannot be reasonably assessed.

----

QUESTION: Would doctor be able to tell me if there is already asbestos in the lungs, or what did you mean by doctor.

REPLY: I repeat: take these questions to your doctor - your own personal physician whom you trust. Don't try to answer personal health questions by asking strangers on the internet, people whose expertise you don't know and people who have not a shred of information about your own personal health, history, risks.

In general the most-significant asbestos-related illnesses occur in occupational exposure - asbestos in the work place.

Research Examples on Tests to Detect Asbestos Injury to Human Lungs

• Aberle, Donise R., Gordon Gamsu, C. Sue Ray, and Irwin M. Feuerstein. "Asbestos-related pleural and parenchymal fibrosis: detection with high-resolution CT." Radiology 166, no. 3 (1988): 729-734.
  Abstract:
  
  Twenty-nine subjects with occupational asbestos exposure and clinical asbestosis were examined with high-resolution computed tomography (HRCT) to determine its sensitivity, relative to that of conventional computed tomography (CT), for detection of benign asbestos-related disease. Thin-section HRCT scans were obtained at five discrete levels through the mid and lower thorax in both prone and supine positions. The same technique was used in 34 age-similar control patients.
  
  Parenchymal abnormalities were seen most frequently in the posterior portion of the lung bases in the asbestos-exposed subjects. HRCT prone scans enabled basal structural abnormalities to be reliably distinguished from gravity-related physiologic phenomena in 25 asbestos-exposed subjects. HRCT was more sensitive than CT in detection of both pleural and parenchymal fibrosis. In subjects with clinical asbestosis, HRCT demonstrated parenchymal abnormality in 96%, compared with 83% for CT.
  
  Similarly, pleural thickening was shown in 100% of subjects at HRCT, compared with 93% at CT. HRCT could be an important adjunct in the evaluation of asbestos-related pleuroparenchymal fibrosis. An HRCT study including prone scans is a sensitive, reliable means of detecting thoracic abnormalities in asbestos-exposed individuals.
  
• Ochsmann, Elke, Tanja Carl, Peter Brand, Hans-Jürgen Raithel, and Thomas Kraus. "Inter-reader variability in chest radiography and HRCT for the early detection of asbestos-related lung and pleural abnormalities in a cohort of 636 asbestos-exposed subjects." International archives of occupational and environmental health 83, no. 1 (2010): 39-46.
  Abstract excerpt:
  High resolution computed tomography scans are superior to X-rays in detecting lung alterations after asbestos exposure and are supposedly easier to interpret. Nevertheless, inter-observer variability did not differ between the two methods in this study. This was probably due to the only discrete asbestos-related lung or pleura alterations of this cohort and to the unfamiliar CT classification sheet, which was revised on the basis of the presented results.
• Kido, Takashi, Yasuo Morimoto, Kazuhiro Yatera, Hiroshi Ishimoto, Takaaki Ogoshi, Keishi Oda, Kei Yamasaki, Toshinori Kawanami, Shohei Shimajiri, and Hiroshi Mukae. "The utility of electron microscopy in detecting asbestos fibers and particles in BALF in diffuse lung diseases." BMC pulmonary medicine 17, no. 1 (2017): 1-9.
  Abstract Excerpts:
  Results
  BALF asbestos were detected in 11 of 48 patients with a history of occupational exposure by EM; whereas asbestos as asbestos bodies (ABs) were detected in BALF in 4 of these 11 patients by LM. Eight of 107 patients in whom lung tissue samples were surgically obtained, EM detected BALF asbestos at a level of >1,000 fibers/ml in all three patients who had ABs in lung tissue samples by LM at a level of >1,000 fibers/g. The BALF asbestos concentration by EM and in lung tissue by LM were positively correlated. The particle fractions of iron and phosphorus were increased in patients with a history of occupational exposure and both correlated with a history of occupational exposure by a multiple regression analysis.
  
  Conclusions
  EM using BALF seemed to be superior to LM using BALF and displayed a similar sensitivity to LM using surgically-obtained lung tissue samples in the detection of asbestos. Our results also suggest that detection of elements, such as iron and phosphorus in particles, is useful for evaluating occupational exposure. We conclude that the detection of asbestos and iron and phosphorus in particles in BALF by EM is very useful for the evaluation of occupational exposure.
• Murray, Kathleen A., Gordon Gamsu, W. Richard Webb, Christopher J. Salmon, and Marlene J. Egger. "High-resolution computed tomography sampling for detection of asbestos-related lung disease." Academic radiology 2, no. 2 (1995): 111-115.
• Lee, G., Y. J. Jeong, K. I. Kim, J. W. Song, D. M. Kang, Y. D. Kim, and J. W. Lee. "Comparison of chest digital tomosynthesis and chest radiography for detection of asbestos-related pleuropulmonary disease." Clinical radiology 68, no. 4 (2013): 376-382.
  
• Roach, Huw D., Gareth J. Davies, Richard Attanoos, Michael Crane, Haydn Adams, and Siân Phillips. "Asbestos: when the dust settles—an imaging review of asbestos-related disease." Radiographics 22, no. suppl_1 (2002): S167-S184.
  Abstract
  Asbestos-related neoplastic and nonneoplastic diseases of the lungs and pleura range from pleural effusion and pleural plaques to lung cancer and malignant mesothelioma. Pleural effusions are typically hemorrhagic exudates of mixed cellularity but do not typically contain asbestos bodies. The classic distribution of pleural plaques seen on chest radiographs is the posterolateral chest wall between the seventh and tenth ribs, lateral chest wall between the sixth and ninth ribs, the dome of the diaphragm, and the mediastinal pleura.
  
  Computed tomographic (CT) findings support this distribution but also show anterior and paravertebral plaques not well shown at chest radiography. Imaging features of diffuse pleural thickening include a continuous sheet, often involving the costophrenic angles and apices, that rarely calcifies. The typical CT features of round atelectasis are of a round or oval mass that abuts the pleura, a “comet tail” of bronchovascular structures going into the mass, and thickening of the adjacent pleura. Features of asbestosis on chest radiographs include ground-glass opacification, small nodular opacities, “shaggy” cardiac silhouette, and ill-defined diaphragmatic contours. CT, however, is more sensitive in their detection.
  
  Chest radiography in patients with malignant mesothelioma may show an effusion, pleural thickening, and as the tumor progresses, a more lobulated outline. CT can help identify the disease in its early stages. Asbestos-related cancers can occur anywhere in the lungs. Recognition of the clinical, radiologic, and pathologic features of these diseases will be important for some years to come.
  
  -----
  

On 2021-04-08 by Anonymous

I am very sorry, I feel like you have some knowlege and I dont know who to ask. I just dont know what to do, because I am scared of any dust now and using furniture and even washing the clothes and all these days are very stressful and my bf thinks i am crazy. I just dont know what to do and looking if someone with asbestos knowledge would have an answer.

So to make the situation simpler, if 2 tablespoons of drywall powder with asbestos and 2 tablespoon of popcorn ceiling powder with asbestos would be all over carpet, clothes and furniture, but remaining powder would be already wiped up on all visible places, the balcony would be open every day few hours already, but there might be asbestos in some furniture, carpet, hidden spaces, what would you please suggest?

What kind of test? Would air test detect anything? The dust test even though everything was wiped would show anything?

Or if I just wet wipe all possible dust, and vacuum carpet, shoes and furniture, I can feel safe? Would you please know if washing in front load washing machine (without dryer) helps to remove asbestos?

Would doctor be able to tell me if there is already asbestos in the lungs, or what did you mean by doctor.

If there would be some hidden dust remaining in some spots or furniture, would that be dangerous and I could be exposed every day, or the exposure would be minimal and I dont have to worry.
Thanks very much!!!

On 2021-04-06 - by (mod) -

@Anonymous, I understand your concern and I apologize I'm sure it's frustrating to run into someone who is simply refuses to make wild guesses based on absolutely no data, when you really want an answer.

But frankly nobody can access your possible exposure to hazardous material simply based on some text and with not a shred of actual data.

What remains is for you to discuss your concerns with your doctor.

On 2021-04-06 by Anonymous

Thank you! The problem is all that possible asbestos dust (from drywall or part of ceiling) was already blown up into the whole apartment where was carpet, furniture, shoes, clothes, kitchen. They also closed the floor so cant get a sample of it anymore. My question is mostly that if the area where was some dust left was 10x10feet (3x3m) and the dust/powder amount could be around 2tablespoons, how dangerous would it be live here after one month when it happened if it would get into air and settled in things? I wiped all the surfaces but it could settle in furniture, fabric things and under fridge and other places hard to get to.

Does washing in washing machine (without using dryer) clean asbestos? If I vacuum the carpet with hepa can I just use it without worry? There is no visible dust anywhere but I am worried it might be still going into air while moving, walking, siting on furniture or wearing some clothes and shoes. Thank you!

On 2021-04-02 21 - by (mod) -

@Anonymous, Mia:

I am guessing that you are talking about plaster dust or drywall dust but of course I can't know that.

If you're worried that the dust contains asbestos - something you can't determine by the naked eye - and if you'd face a significant cost for professional cleaning, you would start by treating the dust as presumed to contain asbestos (for safety, meaning don't make a worse mess of it) and you'll want to have one or two representative dust samples tested by a certified asbestos test lab. You can find those at

ASBESTOS TESTING LAB LIST https://inspectapedia.com/hazmat/Asbestos_Test_Lab_Lists.php

Often damp wiping and HEPA vacuuming are perfectly reasonable ways to clean up questionable dust.

On 2021-04-02 by Mia

Sorry I already asked some questions but have one more issue with possible asbestos.

While company was fixing leak in floor in corner of living room 10x10 feet all the dust from it went into all condo by fans, riping the floor and sanding... When they removed top laminate floor under was old wood floor with many white paint spots (from ceiling most likely) and powder white yellow grey dust what was left from renovation of 1970 condo (done 2 years ago), in that renovation they were opening kitchen so walls were demolished, and also part of the popcorn ceiling for new lights and part of popconr is missing where the wall was removed, bahtroom, plugs....

Looks like they were lazy to clean and wipe the floor and just put new floor over it. Now the amount of dust would be like powdered sugar on a cake on that whole 10x10 feet floor, (maybe if i would wipe it would be 2 teaspoons of it) and I am very worried it could have asbestos from demolishing the wall and ceiling and who know what other asbestos stuff and it went to funriture and carpet and everything. I wiped everything but still worried its in furniture, dust what is hard to reach under furniture and hidden places...would that amount of possible asbestos dust in furniture and air be dangerous? Thank you very much!

@Mia, I ment powdered sugar all over that area not just amount of cake but whole aread. Thanks!

On 2021-03-24 - by (mod) -

@Holes into asbestos walls?,

With all due respect, I don't understand how unscrewing 8 screws in drywall and pulling out 8 nails into drywall would produce tons of dust on tons of shoes;

And we're perhaps mixing up asbestos in plaster with asbestos in drywall with asbestos in popcorn ceiling paint (the article above on this page);

It seems you're asking if your present home is dangerously contaminated by asbestos from dust of unknown properties that might have contained asbestos, that was located in another building, three years ago, and disturbed by the removal of 21 wall fasteners.

Frankly I am doubtful that there is any asbestos hazard you could detect now in your present home that would be ascribed to the original event you describe - not unless somebody did some unusually messy dusty ripping, sanding, grinding, chopping of asbestos-containing drywall (or, less-likely, plaster) - those events don't describe unscrewing some screws nor pulling out nails.

However if you are really frightened of this - fight that urge as the fear itself could be both expensive and a more-immediate health hazard.

You can always HEPA vacuum, damp wipe surfaces, have clothes or soft goods dry-cleaned or laundered, and you could test representative dust samples for asbestos in your present home. Those costs might be significant and don't seem likely to be justified from the original event.

On 2021-03-23 by Holes into asbestos walls?

We put 8 screws (by hand, not by drill, around 1inch long) and 13 nails (some short, some long) into asbestos walls about 3 year ago. Now before moving out of the place we took all out. We didnt even clean the dust after (so it was falling on bed, many things on the floor and tons of shoes what were all right under it) because only now we found out there was asbestos in plaster and mud in walls. Was a lot of asbestos released into the air and into carpet, shoes, clothes, stuff...? In 3 year probably the dust distributed to everything? And now when we took it out more dust was released and we probably took more dust with us on all the stuff to the new place? What should I do please?

Also in our new places they sanded the concrete floor (there was molded glue from wood floor after leak) and all the dust went onto everything in the living room and open kitchen and furniture. They taped some plastic around but still lots of dust was on everything after. Is that dangerous? I read silica dust is very dangerous too. Is enough just wiping it? Can I do it by myself? Thanks so much for advices!!!

On 2021-03-07 - by (mod) - what to do with the top shelf full of clothing and bags what were rubbing against the ceiling for months?

@Asbestos in popcorn ceiling, how to clean?,

To ease your anxiety it's perfectly reasonable to dry clean or launder or use the type of vacuum that I described you are cleaning but I repeat that the total size of area that you were talking about is Trivial and you yourself said that the original popcorn ceiling that you had tested had been coated with multiple coats of paint so it's not likely that just touching it is picking up much of anything

On 2021-03-06 by Asbestos in popcorn ceiling, how to clean? -

omg, thanks so much for your answer! Very appreciate that!!!

Can you also please advice what to do with the top shelf full of clothing and bags what were rubbing against the ceiling for months? I am worried there is now dust between all of it and inside all of it and when I will start to take the stuff out it will float into air. Since the ceiling is probably painted by regular paint there is not tons of dust if any just little bit. Do washing in small home washing machine (without dryer) will clean it? Or do I need to throw everything out? Or for this one would be better to call some cleaning company?

Would you personally use that top shelf for storing stuff? There is heavy mirror doors what bump into wall every time i open and close so I am worried the ceiling is falling slowly not only to top shelf but to all closet.
I cant find where to rent a proper asbestos vacuum, any idea please?
Also while painting the open 1inch hole after sample, does he need to get a proper mask and those hazards protecting clothes? I a worried of more fibres released. Would be good to put water on it before painting? Thank you sooo much!

On 2021-03-06 - by (mod) -

@Asbestos in popcorn ceiling, how to clean?, @Asbestos in popcorn ceiling, how to clean?,

Forgive me for ducking the question a bit,, but I have to explain that no one can make a completely reliable environmental hazard assessment based on a few lines of text. It's always possible that there is something there that we cannot see in your writing.

However the total dust released from scraping one square inch
of popcorn ceiling that includes some asbestos is not likely to produce a serious environmental hazard.

Best procedure would be too damp wipe any dust on hard or horizontal surfaces. If you use disposable Wipes that you fold wipe fold wipe and then throw out you won't simply be spreading the dust around.

If you want to rent or borrow a HEPA rated vacuum cleaner that's also a very thorough way to clean up fine hazardous dust.

if you wipe and clean up dust as best you can it's not likely that there will remain a detectable or measurable hazard from your tiny ceiling scraping project.

As a comparison to illustrate my point, what would be considered as dangerous would be running Power Equipment to try to scrape or sand such a ceiling or actually demolishing the ceiling.

The proper dust mask to wear is an N - 95..

In an industrial environment or at a job where there actually was a significant dust Hazard the workers would not rely on a common N-95 but rather would wear a face fitting respirator.

That's not necessary nor appropriate for the situation that you have described.

On 2021-03-06 by Asbestos in popcorn ceiling, how to clean?

My roomate took 1 inch asbestos ceiling sample (came back positive) in his room, was scraping 20 min because it was harder, like a paint, didnt see any white dust, but when i rubbed the ceiling before i had white powder on my finger. So i think regular paint is on the ceiling,but not proper encapsulating one.

Is there lot of asbestos now from the sample? Is it safe to go there? (it has bed, carpet… where it could land) What could I do to make sure it is asbestos free as much as possible? Can I vacuum the carpet there?

Should he buy proper mask and special clothes while painting the small hole? Should he wet it before painting?

Also clothes and stuff were rubbing against this asbestos ceiling since its inside big closet top shelf. I dont think there is big amount of white powder, but I read asbestos can be invisible. How to best safely clean the stuff? Do I need to hire asbestos cleaning company for cleaning the closet?

Also which mask and vacuum is good for asbestos?Any advice appreciated!

On 2018-02-26 9 by (mod) -

In the US in 1991 it's not likely that a builder would have used asbestos-containing textured ceiling paint.

See ASBESTOS MATERIAL REGULATIONS

and for Canadians

See ASBESTOS REGULATIONS for ONTARIO CANADA - Ontario Regulation 278/05

On 2018-02-26 by Martin

I just painted a textured ceiling from a house that was built in 1991. Pretty much most of my ceilings are textured.

Anyways, as I was painting a bunch of the texture was coming down on me and around me on the floors (like an idiot I didn't wear any protection thinking that it was highly unlikely to contain anything dangerous)

. Although it had been painted before, it seems it is not very sturdy stuff. Do you believe there would be any danger of asbestos in this era of ceiling texture? I currently live in Ontario, Canada.

So, I am not sure what year they stopped using asbestos products over here. I can find a lot of information on when the US stopped using it, but not many people talk about Canada or Ontario.

Great site for information!

On 2018-02-22 by Anna

Thank you for your time and advice. You have been incredibly helpful!

On 2018-02-19 by (mod) -

"nobrando" is most likely slang for unbranded or "I can't see a way to identify the product"
IMO it'd have been nicer to have explained to you what that word meant.

ASBESTOS TESTING LAB LIST provides help in finding a certified asbestos test lab if/when you need to use that service

If you have an idea when the popcorn paint was applied you'd have an idea if it's likely to be asbestos-containing;

It'd be odd but not impossible to find a home where the same coating was sprayed on walls, though generally that'd be avoided since popcorn ceiling paint is usually rather fragile: you'd not be smart to put it on walls where it'd be smeared and smashed regularly.

Daniel

On 2018-02-19 by Anonymous

I know it is impossible to know solely from pictures if this indeed is asbestos, but on second inspection the building inspector has said he believes the material is something called "nobrando" which of course struck us as strange

and needless to say, I cannot find anything about nobrando online. Any ideas?

On 2018-02-19 by Anna

Thank you for your honest and professional opinion. We really feel similarly, so thank you for your reassurance.

On 2018-02-19 by (mod) -

If your home inspector raise the question of a possible significant expense regarding asbestos abatement or removal, and if the seller is refusing to let you determine whether you face that expense, your choices are to walk from the deal or to buy the property assuming that you're going to face that expense.

On 2018-02-19 by (mod) - ? run, as fast as you can towards the property, screaming I WANT IT, I WANTT IT, ? Really?

The remark you cite

In my opinion

seller has now stated that the asbestos issue has been overinflated and to the best of their knowledge, there is no asbestos in the apartment and will cancel the deal with us if we do not go ahead immediately, no further conditions.

Is heavy handed, disrespectful, and disregards you as the buyer.

My mom would have said to remind these cads that YOU are the people with the MONEY. Hello?

That sort of pressure is intended to get you to run, as fast as you can towards the property, screaming I WANT IT, I WANTT IT,
throwing your wallet ahead, Willy nilly.

In my experience people who succumb are often very unhappy later, having been rushed past due diligence by others who have conflicted interests of their own and who have no obligation and no care for you.

On 2018-02-19 by (mod) -

I'm looking at your images

Regrets Anna but I can't say from your photo if that's an asbestos-containing ceiling panel or paint coating. You'll want to have a sample tested IF you are facing making a dusty demolition mess

On 2018-02-18 by Anna

Sorry- didn't mean to post Anonymously. Here is another image, that also shows a bit of the stucco wall. Thank you again in advance.

On 2018-02-18 by Anonymous

Hi, I'm so glad to have found your site.

We are about to buy an apartment that was built in the 60's.

There is a gas water boiler in a hidden room behind the fridge, that the first building inspector suggested contained asbestos suspicious materials.

We requested the material be removed before signing a contract, to which they agreed, but the seller has now stated the materials cannot be removed as not only screwed into the wall but also glued on and have decided they will not remove it, or allow for further delays (for us to request an asbestos check with the lab). In addition, the entire wall surface of the kitchen and living room has a deeply textured popcorn look, which I have seen on your site could possibly contain asbestos.

I was already feeling nervous and now feel worse. We are not feeling very good about this, and hope you can help. Apparently, the apartment was renovated in the 90's, although when we ask we cannot get a clear answer on what was changed or worked on during that time. They tell us asbestos was not allowed to be used in the 90's so that should remove our doubts.

We certainly know the building had asbestos as there was a plan for removal of the asbestos from public spaces in the building

. The seller has now stated that the asbestos issue has been overinflated and to the best of their knowledge, there is no asbestos in the apartment and will cancel the deal with us if we do not go ahead immediately, no further conditions.

We don't want to make a big mistake or take on a heavy financial burden.

Perhaps you can shed some light on whether our doubts are justified or not. I have more images, in case this one is not clear enough. Thank you!

On 2017-10-24 by Donna

Can an asbestos positive popcorn ceiling result also contain styrofoam and perlite?

On 2017-03-05 by (mod) -

IMO yes

On 2017-03-05 by Tom Ruggierio

If a textured ceiling sometime between 1978 - 1982 was painted on not sprayed on with a special roller and paint could it still contain asbestos

On 2019-01-03 by (mod) -

Chris I can't do better than your certified asbestos test lab who processed your sample.

In any environmental sampling plan the choice of sample material and how it is collected are critical - if you think the sample is representative of your indoor conditions, that's what you want.

On 2019-01-03 by Chris

I recently bought a house built in 1953. I had the popcorn ceiling removed by a second party and unfortunately did not have it tested. The ceiling was then covered with drywall mud and sanded.

I freaked out a bit after researching more on asbestos and ended up getting some of the dust left from the sanding tested. It came back negative for asbestos.

Is it safe to say that from those results that the popcorn ceiling did not contain asbestos?

On 2018-11-21 by (mod) -

Bad news.

First. It's worth having a couple of tests done, one on some loose paint that comes off and a second on an actual sample of the stucco coating.

That's about $80 to $100 US - find a certified asbestos test lab in the page top EXPERTS DIRECTORY (no don't send it to us) and the lab will also describe safe sampling procedures for you.

That way we know if you have to deal with asbestos or just normal demolition and renovation dust and debris.

THEN if the result confirms asbestos, the safest approach would be to laminate a layer of 1/4" drywall over the ceiling, leaving it alone and in place. Tape the joints and paint the new taped ceiling.

If there is NO asbestos in the ceiling then you can choose the dusty mess of cleaning it and prepping it and re-painting (still you need to control dust and protect yourself) or you could still go the laminate over route.

Also see

• Asbestos NESHAP ADEQUATELY WET ASBESTOS GUIDANCE, EPA340/1-90-019, December 1990, U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY, Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards, Stationary Source Compliance Division, Washington, DC 20460,original web source: http://www.epa.gov/region04/air/asbestos/awet.htm
• EPA Guidance for Controlling Asbestos-Containing Materials in buildings, NIAST, National Institute on Abatement Sciences & Technology, [republishing EPA public documents] 1985 ed., Exposure Evaluation Division, Office of Toxic Substances, Office of Pesticides and Toxic Substances, U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, Washington,D.C. 20460

On 2018-11-21 by Larryd

I painted my stucco ceiling with a latex paint, after i had painted it i found out the stucco could contain asbestos (as informed by my property management) now (a couple years later) the latex paint has started to peel away, i would like to fix it up, but im afraid that by pulling down loose paint it will disturb the asbestos. what is my best course of action?

On 2018-03-26 by NoNo

I have a popcorn ceiling that I know does not contain any asbestos in it. It does have glitter.

It is a small area. Is there a way to repaint it without using a sprayer? I am not concerned about covering the glitter. I have looked at lots of sites on the internet and I found nothing on how to repaint and what kind of paint to use. I would prefer to roll it if I can. Thank you for your help.

On 2018-01-18 by (mod) -

Reader question received by private email

We live in an appartment with popcorn ceiling. I recently realized that my child has been playing with the ceiling from his bunk bed. He has put his feet up against the ceiling and a few "popcorns" came off.

I have read that an asbestos popcorn ceiling is only dangerous when damaged, so my question is if what my son has done to it would be considered damaged.

Do we need to treat the ceiling or remove it, because a few balls have been thrown on it, or can we leave it and make sure nobody messes with it in the future?


Reply:

Kicking off bits of it is damage that could release (probably quite small) amounts of material.
I would launder the bedding and bedclothes.

And I'd saw a few inches off of the feet of his bunk bed so that he can no longer reach the ceiling. You can leave the ceiling alone as long as it's not being disturbed further.

On 2018-01-13 by dee

s c r a p i n g - apparently Comment Box software changes the word "scrape" to "scrape" - telling us that their censors have run amok.

On 2018-01-13 by dee

for some reason when i type in scrap ing it comes up as sloping

On 2018-01-13 by (mod) -

Sorry, Dee, but "sloveping" is not a word I know, nor could I find a definition of it. (Editor's note: later we found that Comment Box programmers were editing any word containing "crap" to "love" such as scrape became slove. )

At ASBESTOS LIST of PRODUCTS we discuss the use of asbestos in some wallpaper products (and in some paints).

On 2018-01- by dee

sloveping (she meant "scraping" - Ed)

On 2018-01-13 by dee

in our 1920's house, there was slightly textured old (non coloured - white only) wallpaper that came off easily with light sloveing, leaving remnants of wallpaper glue and paper on plaster ceiling.

i knew popcorn ceilings were a concern but wasn't thinking about this wallpaper and as it came off so easily? any thoughts if i contaminated our house with invisible asbestos dust?

On 2017-11-14 by Peter Hilditch

Hi. I am looking into asbestos in Artex and other textured ceiling products such as Bettertex and Wondertex. although it is said there was asbestos in the product, are there any documents/photos of the product from the 1970's or other info confirming this?

On 2017-10-28 by Lorne

Does Gyptex texturing paint (By Domtar) contain asbestos?

On 2017-05-07 by (mod) -

I can't say how worried you could be - we don't know the age of your home, its ceiling, nor what the ceiling paint contains. At a minimum I'd use damp wiping and/or HEPA vacuuming to clean up while minimizing dust. Other advice is in the article above.

On 2017-05-07 by Sandra

I think I have popcorn paint on my kitchen ceiling. A leak has brought a portion of the paint down. Should I be worried? What should I do next to protect myself?

On 2016-11-05 by Guu

I am living in an apt that was built in 2000. The living room and bedrooms have "popcorn" look ceiling. I am wondering if it is safe for me to assume that this ceiling does not contain asbestos, given it was built in 2000?

On 2016-06-26 by (mod) -

Beth please review the article above as my best suggestions that answer your question are there; let me know if anything therein is unclear or incomplete and I'll be glad to add that information.

Generally start by knowing the age of your building or if you can, the age of the ceiling. Finish by having material tested.

On 2016-06-26 15:57:55.260393 by Beth

How do I know if my ceiling contain asbestos? My pop corn ceiling is soft and it comes off so easy..

Question: broken 1950's Homart Starspray Acoustical Ceiling Tiles

My home has broken Homart Starspray Acoustical Ceiling Tiles which were purchased and installed sometime in the 1950's or 1960's. How can I find out if this was asbestos? The product number is #8445. Help! - Anon 7/20/11

Reply:

I'd like to see some sharp photos of those ceiling tiles (see our CONTACT link at the ARTICLE INDEX the bottom of this article or bottom or top). From the age of your ceiling tiles, that they are asbestos-containing is a reasonable assumption.

If you need to know for sure, you can send a small sample to a certified asbestos testing laboratory - it's not expensive.

Best to check with the lab about what procedure they want you to use to collect a sample, basically you pick an unobtrusive area, avoid creating a dusty mess, wet down and remove 1/2" fragment.
of material and bag it)

Question: Possible asbestos content in popcorn ceilings in an older home - also mold & asthma worries

i live in san diego,ca in a 1936 old house that has mold inside as well as outside the home my friend was born in this house and he said the wall paper the popcorn ceiling carpet doors windows cabin ts still the same since he was a lil child he is now 50 yrs old i been getting sick nausea headache been hospitalize for asthma attack me and my daughter - Trina 11/13/12

Reply:

Trina,

Check with your doctor, but I don't think asbestos exposure produces asthma. In an older home that has not been cleaned nor updated, there could certainly be various respiratory irritants, insect fragments, mold, animal allergens, dust mites etc.

However, popcorn ceilings that are old often used asbestos fibers and filler in the coating.

See MOLD EXPERT, WHEN TO HIRE for help in deciding if it is appropriate to hire an expert to inspect your home.

Question: is cleaning up dust after improper asbestos removal dangerous

How dangerous is it to clean up an area after asbestos tiles were removed without proper equipment or disposal? What is required to be safe during clean-up? - Darlene 1/21/2013

Reply: quite possibly

Darlene: in my OPINION the answer is at least potentially YES.

If asbestos containing material, particularly friable materials such as ceiling tiles, or any ACM that was removed in a manner that created dust was removed without proper dust containment and follow-up testing, there could be high enough levels of asbestos in remaining dust in the building to be a hazard to occupants.

For example, running an ordinary household (non-HEPA) vacuum cleaner, or even a HEPA rated vacuum if it leaks, would send that asbestos-containing dust into the air - where occupants may indeed breathe it.

In my own experience I've encountered this problem a number of times and often follow-up testing confirmed that further professional cleaning was needed.

Provided that there is an established need (and thus justification of the expense) for an asbestos dust cleanup, a professional will set up dust containment to keep other building areas safe from dust, use a negative air machine as part of that containment, then typically s/he will HEPA vacuum and damp wipe the building surfaces.

A follow-up test by a professional confirms that the cleanup was successful and that the containment system also worked.

At ASBESTOS TESTING LAB LIST we provide information on how to find a qualified, certified asbestos testing laboratory.

Question: popcorn ceiling paint removal, asbestos test results, textured paint cleanup procedures

I found your web site very informative. I have a concern about my home which was built in 1976. When I purchased the home I had the popcorn ceiling removed by a professional company. Some of the rooms had already been removed by the home owner.

When I bought the house the previous owner told me there wasn't asbestos in the ceiling.

Years later a neighbor had the ceiling tested VIA a lab and there was asbestos.

Would there be trace amounts of asbestos remaining and would this be any health issue?

Should I not wear clothing from a top closet shelf that gets very dusty?

Also, there are some tiles 8X8 throughout the house. Looks like early to mid 1980s.

The surface is hard white glazed tile but underneath looks like clay. There are cracks in a few of them. I put Super Glue in all the cracks. Will the glue prevent possible asbestos from being airborne? - K.F. 7/7/2013

Reply:

I hope you will understand that from just an email query no one can honestly nor reliably assert whether or not there is an asbestos hazard in the home about which you inquire. However I can offer the following OPINON:

Any time I hear that asbestos-containing materials or asbestos-suspect materials were "removed by the homeowner" that is a bit of a red flag: it is unlikely that an ordinary homeowner would know how to follow appropriate steps for dust containment, wetting, material removal, negative air, testing, etc.

therefore it would certainly be possible that asbestos-contaminated dust could remain behind in such a building as well as incompletely-removed asbestos-containing materials. It would thus be prudent to look into the question further. IN such a look I would not rely just on air testing - as the risk of a false negative is just too high

. But it might make sense to test some samples of settled dust that you think represent various areas in the home or areas of highest risk. Use a certified asbestos testing lab (do not send samples to me). Keep me posted on what you learn as it may help others.

About asbestos in ceramic tile, I discuss that question at https://InspectAPedia.com/hazmat/Ceramic_Tile_Asbestos_Content.php and would welcome any follow-up questions if that article is incomplete or unclear in your view.

Reader follow-up: unnecessary disposal of washable items out of concern for asbestos

Thank you so much for your opinion.

I did throw in some blankets that were dusty from the top closet shelf just a few hours ago into the washing machine. Oops!!!

I used a double rinse but after I read your email, I just threw the blankets out.

I kept the rest of the clothes that were washing in the machine but used two rinses. In your opinion should I get rid of all the clothes and is the washing machine safe to use?

I have 3 kids and I'm a single mom. I value your opinion and I thank you for your time.

Reply: lab rest results before & after washing asbestos-dust-contaminated fabrics

I can't cite an authoritative source on this question, but my own field and lab testing of particle-contaminated clothing have found very few remaining particles after clothes are laundered or dry cleaned.

My procedure was to vacuum the fabric surface, collecting particles in an air sampling cassette designed for that purpose. I vacuumed the same fabric in the same area on the fabric before and after cleaning.

After cleaning I found only occasional trace occurrences of particles in the fabrics. T

OPINION: This may not quite be the case for severely-contaminated fabrics, or those with complex structure or many layers; in such cases more extensive cleaning might be required.

But normally particle contamination found on clothing has found its way onto the outer surface of garments that were worn in or left in a dusty environment. In such cases one would not expect particulates to penetrate deep into clothing layers such as inside shoulder pads.

Reader follow-up: asbestos test finds asbestos content in textured ceiling spray paint

You had previously asked me to let you know about my home asbestos inspection.

I think this one bit of information might help other homeowners.

The previous owner sent off asbestos samples from the ceiling to a lab. I did not see the report but according to the owner the results were negative. When other neighbors heard of his negative lab results, they assumed their homes were also free of asbestos. All homes were built by same builder at the same time. I know of two neighbors that scraped their ceilings without masks or protection.

One neighbor decided to send in her own sample and that sample came back positive for asbestos.

During my home inspection recently, we found an old light fixture that had been sprayed with acoustic. That was tested and showed 3 percent asbestos. The previous owner was incorrect.

My ceilings had been scraped by a company years ago. I did handle some of the plastic that contained the scraped debris as I wasn't worried since I had been told"asbestos free."

I came away from this realizing that you should independently test your own home and not take the word of someone selling their house or a neighbor. They could be wrong.

The rest of the results: Acoustic overspray in air registers.

I also had a pipe covered with asbestos but it's in good shape.

The drywall compound/mud covering the wall tape tested as less than 1 per cent asbestos. Unfortunately I have large cracks in the garage and the door has done a lot of damage hitting the garage wall.

The only thing I can think of is to spray the cracks/holes with a compound spray and then a paint spray as I'm scared to disturb the fibers with paintbrush. Does this sound like a decent idea? I'm hoping this will encapsulate the fibers.

Thanks for your help and I hope this information can be useful.

Reply: do not rely on a seller assertion of asbestos test results, especially when not in writing

Certainly your experience will be helpful to others and I'll find the appropriate place to post it for other readers. And certainly as well, I'm sorry that your lawyer and real estate agent involved when you bought your home were not working with your interest in mind.

If either of them had been doing so, s/he would have advised you of the error of relying on any representation by the seller of a property - the combination of the conflicts of interest and the simple chance of making a mistake add up to reasons never to rely on such a representation, all the more so, as a giant red flag, when the representation is made only orally and not in writing to include the provision of independent, professional reports.

A simple case I've come across time and again is that even when a "lab test" was performed, the test sample was selected from an area believed to be outside the area of concern, rather than testing what should have been tested.

At this point your first step is to avoid making a dusty mess by disturbing asbestos-suspect materials. Most often the risk of leaving in place non-friable, intact, material not in a place likely to be damaged - is low.

Reader follow-up: can I encapsulate an asbestos-paint coated wall with joint compound and paint?

I was hoping to encapsulate the wall behind the door by spraying it with a joint compound spray and then spraying it with paint. This area has been badly damaged from the door hitting the wall.

Would this be O.K.?

Reply:

in my OPINION and presuming that you have reason to know or think that the walls in your home also are covered with asbestos-containing textured paint, new joint compound is soft and will break again if smacked by a door hitting the wall.

It's not the best protection against future wall damage and possible asbestos disturbance unless additional steps are taken.

It is indeed common to seal friable surfaces using a sprayed paint coating; using a joint compound repair (or better, laminating 1/4" drywall over the whole area) is fine, provided you also install a door stop to protect the wall from damage.

Question: does having been painted over make asbestos-containing textured ceiling paint harder to remove?

(Mar 3, 2015) Rob said:
I have had the popcorn ceiling tested and it has asbestos. The ceiling has been painted. My question is, does the paint make it harder to remove safely or does it help to contain? Also, will the paint make it more difficult to remove?

(June 30, 2015) Luan said:
Like Rob, I have the same problem, the same question.

Reply:

Rob and Luan,

Asbestos-containing popcorn ceiling paint is usually rather soft and fragile so that painting over it does not work well as an encapsulant. Removing it safely requires expertise, wetting, dust control, etc.

But if space allows, the least expensive and perfectly proper alternative is to laminate a layer of thin drywall (say 1/4" thick) over the entire ceiling, tape the joints and paint the new surface.

Question: styrofoam in textured ceiling paint replaced asbestos?

(Feb 16, 2016) William said:

Re: my comment below, it was the early nineties.

Is the styrofoam-like material the only non-asbestos successor? We had a material applied in the '90s, which was bought at a building supply store. It's quite hard to the touch.

Reply: formulas for textured and popcorn ceiling coatings

There are more than one formula for textured and "popcorn" style ceiling paints including besides styrofoam, plaster or joint compound. In any event in North America (if that's where you are) it's not likely that asbestos-containing textured paint would still be applied in the 1990's as it fell out of use after 1978's Clean Air Act in the U.S.

Current textured or popcorn ceiling paint typically include styrofoam, macerated cardboard, or vermiculite. ceramic materials, as well as polyvinyl adhesives. (Note that depending on where it was mined, some vermiculite may have contained asbestos). Patented popcorn ceiling patching materials also include stick-on paint-over pre-molded patches.

Popcorn ceiling paint has been popular as a way to cover cosmetic defects and also for its acoustic sound-dampening properties.

see these contemporary textured and popcorn ceiling references

Estape, Roberto. "Foam wall system." U.S. Patent Application 10/337,469, filed January 7, 2003.

Judd, Jennifer. "Popcorn ceiling patch." U.S. Patent Application 14/449,681, filed August 1, 2014.

Kubic, Thomas A. "Method for repairing a textured ceiling or overhead surface." U.S. Patent 5,474,804, issued December 12, 1995.

Woods, John R. "Acoustic ceiling patch spray." U.S. Patent 5,505,344, issued April 9, 1996.

Woods, John R. "Hardenable flowable substance applicable for acoustic ceiling patch in the form of spray contains, water 20-27%, filler 40-80%, polyvinyl adhesive binder 1-50%, propellant 5-20%, aggregate 2-40%, antifoam agent 1-10% suspension agent 1-20%." U.S. Patent 7,163,962, issued January 16, 2007.

INC, TECH TRADERS. "Product & Technology Review." (2007). (ceramic popcorn paint components)

Question: popcorn ceiling done in 1994 in Canada contains asbestos?

(Feb 23, 2016) Frank said:
We have popcorn ceiling in my house. House was built I believe in the early 50s. We moved here in 1994 and it did not have the popcorn ceiling then. I had the popcorn ceiling done the same year, 1994. This is in Canada.

Any chance popcorn ceiling installed in 1994 in Canada would contain asbestos? Also, I am a tall person and routinely stretch with object in my hand and end up scraping the ceiling, would this be enough to release fibers if they were indeed present? Thanks

A correction to my question... *MOST* of the popcorn ceiling was installed in 1994, but some of it was there before we moved in and it has been painted over.

Reply:

Frank, as a technical guy I cannot ever say there is NO chance of something, but it would be very unusual for 1994 textured or popcorn ceiling paint to contain asbestos.
IF there is older popcorn ceiling paint installed say before the early 1980's, yes it may contain asbestos. In my OPINION

(Feb 24, 2016) Frank said:
I'm strongly inclined to think the newer stuff doesn't contain asbestos but it's likely the old stuff did. I remember picking at it at one point too wondering how soft it was back before I knew it could contain asbestos. I have no way of knowing when the old popcorn ceiling was done, sometime between the 50s and when I purchased the place in '94.

It has been painted over probably twice now since I've lived here, which I'm assuming would help lessen any risk.

Apart from some cracks in a few seems/corners, it's in good shape. Like I said before, being tall I have a tendency to stretch and accidentally scrape the ceiling with random objects I'm holding while I stretch. Could that cause enough damage to release fibers in your opinion?

Also, even when asbestos textured paints were used, were they the majority of the market or was there also many products that existed for popcorn ceiling that were asbestos free back then? Thanks

Moderator reply:

On asbestos content, We agree, that's what I warned earlier.

Quite a few popcorn ceilings I've encountered were indeed rather fragile, easily producing friable materials or dust, both older (asbestos-containing) and newer products using styrene, styrofoam, vermiculite (some of which also may contain asbestos depending on where the vermiculite originated).

Painting over such ceilings probably reduces the hazard.

Just how much dust is being released by accidental contact I can't guess. One would need to get objective data based on real measurements, perhaps constructing a worst, most-likely, and least extensive damage sampling plan. I'm doubtful that the cost of a competent exposure study is cost-justified for a normal residence like the one you describe.

...

Continue reading  at CEILING PAINT TEXTURED / POPCORN ASBESTOS or select a topic from the closely-related articles below, or see the complete ARTICLE INDEX.

Or see these

Recommended Articles

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• CEILING PAINT TEXTURED / POPCORN ASBESTOS
• ASBESTOS CEILING TILE IDENTIFICATION - 5 Easy Steps to tell if CEILING TILES are likely to contain asbestos
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